Plato Shrimp / Sight & Sound's 2022 Greatest Films of All-Time List

**Posted by Jinnistan** 12/02/2022 6:45 pm

Just occurred to me that there's no Robert Altman on the list either.

**Posted by crumbsroom** 12/04/2022 5:11 pm

Jinnistan wrote:
Just occurred to me that there's no Robert Altman on the list either.

Yes, that's a bad one too. But I guess tastes change and it seems that a few of my favorites are sliding out of favor.

**Posted by Rock** 12/04/2022 10:56 pm

These are my current blind spots. Guess I got a lot of movies to watch.

**Posted by Jinnistan** 12/04/2022 11:42 pm

I'm going to steal this from Little Ash, an interesting interactive article on all of the changes the Sight & Sound list has gone through over the years.

**Posted by Jinnistan** 12/04/2022 11:43 pm

crumbsroom wrote:
I guess tastes change and it seems that a few of my favorites are sliding out of favor.

The problem with "favor" is that it tends to be fickle.

**Posted by Jinnistan** 12/04/2022 11:54 pm

My blindspots from the Director's List:

Vagabond
La Cienaga
Satantango
Tropical Malady
Where Is the Friend's House
A Brighter Summer Day
Sans Soleil
News From Home
Shoah
Yi Yi

(I don't always understand the preference for title language - Rules of the Game and Breathless in French, but then Cache is in English?)

A Separation is a good example of a somewhat recent film that I don't really understand it's high placement here. It's a good film. Is it Paris Texas good? I just don't understand it. Then again, I honestly don't understand Singing in the Rain either.

**Posted by crumbsroom** 12/09/2022 12:16 pm

Jinnistan wrote:
My blindspots from the Director's List:

Vagabond
La Cienaga
Satantango
Tropical Malady
Where Is the Friend's House
A Brighter Summer Day
Sans Soleil
News From Home
Shoah
Yi Yi

(I don't always understand the preference for title language - Rules of the Game and Breathless in French, but then Cache is in English?)

A Separation is a good example of a somewhat recent film that I don't really understand it's high placement here. It's a good film. Is it Paris Texas good? I just don't understand it. Then again, I honestly don't understand Singing in the Rain either.

I think Singing in the Rain is a pretty exceptional musical, and I think it is probably better than a lot of the standard bearers if the era.

But, as always, I think films that are about filmmaking do have a tendency to appeal to the people who make these lists. And the fact that Rain is about such an historically important moment in film, can't help but bump it up in the esteem of others.

Still though, I think it pretty much stands as the great classic musical, in the same way that Casablanca perfected rich storytelling in film. Or Wizard of Oz brought emotional heft to childhood whimsy. They are time capsules for when Hollywood was really figuring this shit out. And they do seem to stand the test of time with your average audience as well as critics

**Posted by crumbsroom** 12/09/2022 12:23 pm

I'm pretty sure I've seen A Separation and remember nothing other than it seemed like quality. Nothing wrong with that. Some movies just need to be good. But I prefer things that really stick out aesthetically, or have obvious personal touches.

**Posted by Rock** 12/09/2022 12:55 pm

From JJ’s blind spots, I’ve seen Vagabond and News From Home.

The former is very good, it would probably find itself on a best of the ‘80s list if I made one. Considering how Varda became a meme-ish cuddly figure later in life, I appreciate how prickly it allows its heroine to be.

The latter I found interesting conceptually, but the actual experience of watching a bunch of street footage without comment or even music is a little trying. You can see how Akerman’s fiction films are lent a certain shape by their protagonists. I read some of the appraisals of the movie, and this is one case I’m tempted to declare that the emperor has no clothes. Whatever emotion these defenders think is in the movie I frankly see nothing to indicate it’s actually there. I think Marie Menken’s Go! Go! Go! does a similar thing, but with actual variation in effect, in a much shorter amount of time.

**Posted by crumbsroom** 12/09/2022 7:09 pm

Jinnistan wrote:
My blindspots from the Director's List:

Vagabond
La Cienaga
Satantango
Tropical Malady
Where Is the Friend's House
A Brighter Summer Day
Sans Soleil
News From Home
Shoah
Yi Yi

(I don't always understand the preference for title language - Rules of the Game and Breathless in French, but then Cache is in English?)

A Separation is a good example of a somewhat recent film that I don't really understand it's high placement here. It's a good film. Is it Paris Texas good? I just don't understand it. Then again, I honestly don't understand Singing in the Rain either.

Vagabond - great but surprised to see it on the list. Always seemed more like an overlooked gem. But not hugely consequential.

La Cienega - pretty sure I've seen this but I have literally no memory of it

Satantango - I would be lying if I didn't possibly consider this my least favorite Tarr. Doesn't mean it isn't very good....but it's alot. And the cat stuff, no matter how much Haneke assures was not real, really aggravated me.

Tropical Malady - probably my favorite of his, and since he deserves a spot on the list, a must see

Friends House - a favorite of all time. Adore everything about it.

Brighter Summers Day - same as above. And somehow completely devestated me. Equal parts beautiful, harrowing and cool as fuck

Sans Soleil - too smart for me. But compelling stuff. Struggle at times to pull it all together though...or maybe youre not supposed to. Dumbdumbdumb

Shoah - what can possibly be said. Somehow makes the Holocaust feel even worse than I thought it was, and does so without the usual graphic news real footage. Greatest Christmas present ever

Yiyi - only the vaguest recollections, but I know it made a very strong impression on me many years ago

**Posted by Jinnistan** 12/09/2022 9:24 pm

crumbsroom wrote:
I think Singing in the Rain is a pretty exceptional musical, and I think it is probably better than a lot of the standard bearers if the era.

But, really, is it that much better than Red Shoes or Umbrellas of Cherbourg? I admit, the musical is not my favorite genre, but outside of Cyd....

**Posted by Jinnistan** 12/09/2022 9:36 pm

crumbsroom wrote:
La Cienega - pretty sure I've seen this but I have literally no memory of it

The only film from Martel I've seen is Zama, and it was very good. If I were going to go to bat for a 21st century European director, it would probably be Paolo Sorrentino. Love everything I've yet seen from him.

crumbsroom wrote:
Tropical Malady - probably my favorite of his, and since he deserves a spot on the list, a must see

I love the 'Joe's I've seen - Uncle Boonmee, Cemetery of Splendor, Memoria - but haven't seen his early work. And, according to Little Ash, it doesn't appear that Malady is easy to come by.

crumbsroom wrote:
Shoah - what can possibly be said. Somehow makes the Holocaust feel even worse than I thought it was, and does so without the usual graphic news real footage. Greatest Christmas present ever.

Here's the thing: I know how bad it was! I don't want to know how worse it was. If we could strap Kanye into some Ludovico screening? I'll be right there to moisten his eyeballs, I swear.

**Posted by crumbsroom** 12/10/2022 12:47 am

Jinnistan wrote:
Here's the thing: I know how bad it was! I don't want to know how worse it was. If we could strap Kanye into some Ludovico screening? I'll be right there to moisten his eyeballs, I swear.

Fair enough. But it's an impressive feat nonetheless. To understand that what is even more upsetting than the human viscera of evil actions might actually be the minute details that lead us to them.

Every Holocaust needs someone to build its outhouses. To manufacturer its screws.

**Posted by crumbsroom** 12/10/2022 12:55 am

Jinnistan wrote:
crumbsroom wrote:
I think Singing in the Rain is a pretty exceptional musical, and I think it is probably better than a lot of the standard bearers if the era.
But, really, is it that much better than Red Shoes or Umbrellas of Cherbourg? I admit, the musical is not my favorite genre, but outside of Cyd....

I prefer it to both of those. Even though, it must be said, when Gene Kelly isn't dancing he's the fucking worst. Admittedly, a huge handicap.

**Posted by Jinnistan** 12/10/2022 12:56 am

If I could, I would have...."gladly" isn't the right word....preferred a one-stop 9-hour 26-minute inoculation of Holocaust knowledge to the years of reading these horrors in other formats.

I'm not averse to volunteering my free time down at the pediatric burn ward either. Except, yeah, I kinda am.

**Posted by crumbsroom** 12/10/2022 1:01 am

Jinnistan wrote:
If I could, I would have...."gladly" isn't the right word....preferred a one-stop 9-hour 26-minute inoculation of Holocaust knowledge to the years of reading these horrors in other formats.

I'm not averse to volunteering my free time down at the pediatric burn ward either. Except, yeah, I kinda am.

I'll say this about Shoah...it didn't make feel better about anything. And that feeling has probably stuck for the six or seven years since I first saw it.

**Posted by crumbsroom** 12/10/2022 1:02 am

I imagine Gene Kelly is the main reason I hate Xanadu.

**Posted by crumbsroom** 12/10/2022 1:03 am

And, yes, it seems exactly right to keep alternating between feelings about the devastation of the Holocaust and feelings about how bad Gene Kelly's acting is.

**Posted by Jinnistan** 12/10/2022 1:19 am

crumbsroom wrote:
I'll say this about Shoah...it didn't make feel better about anything. And that feeling has probably stuck for the six or seven years since I first saw it.

This is Willy Loman-quality salesmanship, crumbs.

crumbsroom wrote:
And, yes, it seems exactly right to keep alternating between feelings about the devastation of the Holocaust and feelings about how bad Gene Kelly's acting is.

Ok. I will admit. Singing in the Rain is better than the Holocaust. And Cyd Charisse should have done a Nazi She-Wolf musical.

**Posted by crumbsroom** 12/10/2022 1:27 am

Jinnistan wrote:
crumbsroom wrote:
I'll say this about Shoah...it didn't make feel better about anything. And that feeling has probably stuck for the six or seven years since I first saw it.
This is Willy Loman-quality salesmanship, crumbs.

crumbsroom wrote:
And, yes, it seems exactly right to keep alternating between feelings about the devastation of the Holocaust and feelings about how bad Gene Kelly's acting is.
Ok. I will admit. Singing in the Rain is better than the Holocaust. And Cyd Charisse should have done a Nazi She-Wolf musical.

I laughed! Twice! But I'm also on mushrooms, so maybe it doesn't count.